Talk:Eskimo bowline

ABoK

Surprisingly, for an "ancient" knot, I don't immediately find this knot in the ABoK. Jordan Brown (talk) 21:10, 28 June 2013 (UTC)

Combine Eskimo and Cosack loop articles

If the Eskimo and Cosack knots are indeed the same, the mirror image, minor variations, or confused as to which variation is named which, then perhaps the articles should be combined. Alexgenaud (talk) 20:35, 12 August 2020 (UTC)

Yes, did that now. Buz11 (talk) 20:47, 19 October 2021 (UTC)

The two knots are different (Eskimo and Cosack)

If you look closely at the illustrations, the one tied in orange rope is not the same knot as the one tied in white rope. The orange one can be made into the Cossack loop/Kalmyk loop by slipping it and dressing it so the quick release bight is next to the standing part. You can't do that with the one tied in white rope. If you took the white rope's final turn the other way around the descending line, I think it would be the same, but a left handed version.

Right now, I'm not sure which is the "true" Eskimo bowline, but most places I've looked, it's tied like the one in the orange rope. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Harold14370 (talk • contribs) 14:29, 16 December 2017 (UTC)

They are left-right mirrors of each other and the final end loop around the larger loop is reversed. I expect they are functionally equivalent knots. I have no idea if either is definitively an Eskimo or Cossack loop. Alexgenaud (talk) 20:47, 12 August 2020 (UTC)

I tried to find those knots on Russian websites; mostly I found the 'red rope' variant. I replaced the silver rope variant image by the Cossack knot image. The Russian Wikipedia article shows the variant as "One of the variants of the Eskimo loop with the running end outward, used to create a lasso." Hm. The Russian Eskimo loop Wikipedia page also says that it is slightly different from the Cossack knot - but the Cossack knot page shows the same knot. The difference might lie in how it is tied. There's some more info there (Google translated), which seems to be taken from the Russian version of Budworth's book:

The explorer of the Arctic - Sir John Ross brought to England the Eskimo sleigh, which the Eskimo gave him. The technique of making the sleigh and the materials used in their manufacture prove that the knot was invented by the Eskimos on their own. The sleigh is on display at the British Museum in London.

Does anyone have Budworth's book and can provide an original quote? Buz11 (talk) 23:34, 19 October 2021 (UTC)

Eskimo bowlines

Geoffrey Budworth. The complete guide to Knots and Knot Tying p.179

Eskimo bowline - "This variation on the orthodox bowline is sometimes referred to as the Boas bowline. Thc Arctic explorer Sir John Ross brought an Inuit (Eskimo) sed back to England that had been presented to him by Insuts. It contained numerous such knots in its rawhide lashings. evidence that this was a genuine Inuit knot. The sled is now in the basement oi the Museum of Mankind, London. As it is more secure than the common bowline, especially in synthetic lines, it is worth leaning."

NIC COMPTON. The Knot Bible: The Complete Guide to Knots and Their Uses p.128

Eskimo bowline - "bowline variation"

Skryagin, Lev (1994). Морские узлы.

Крабья петля

Cossack knots

Skryagin, Lev (1994). Морские узлы.

Cossack knot - "is Kalmyk loop withot end loop".

They are(Eskimo bowline, Cossack knot) pretty similar, but have different diagrams. i suggest to unmerge. Buz11 Alexgenaud Zaripov999 (talk) 07:23, 21 November 2021 (UTC)

Cossack_knot_and_eskimo_bowline_compare. I guess there is no possability convert 1 to 3 with "slipping" Zaripov999 (talk) 06:13, 22 November 2021 (UTC)

I checked Budworth and Compton: Their Eskimo bowlines are the Cossack knot (1 and 2 in your diagram, B-C loop with standing part D in the bowline family diagram), and also the kalmyk loop without slip. I can't find any reference to the variant 3 and 4 in your diagram (A-C loop, standing part D).

BTW, when pulled tight, 1 and 2 make no difference; also 3 and 4 dress into the same knot. (Edit: but different from 1&2)

The Crabber's knot you mention (Skryagin #117) is indeed more related to that variant (3/4), but that is not the Eskimo bowline, since the working end and standing part are swapped (A-C loop, standing part B), giving it some different characteristic (slide and lock), so it would justify a separate article as Crabber's knot (it doesn't seem to be very common though).

You'd need to find a book that shows the A-C loop with standing part D (your 3/4) named Eskimo bowline and considered at least as reliable as Budworth and Compton to justify a change. —Buz11 (talk) 19:10, 27 November 2021 (UTC)

Also got the same in another book. —Buz11 (talk) 21:53, 27 November 2021 (UTC)

References