Talk:Robin Olds

Untitled

In SEA his mustache was a "bullet-proof" mustache--Air Force pilots by the hundreds sported them. It was only back in the US that it became a "mark of his individuality."--Buckboard 12:45, 1 December 2006 (UTC)

Olds as first Vetnam Ace?

Several sources claim that Olds intentionally avoided shooting down a fifth MiG, even during opportunities to do so, because he believed he would be immediately relieved of command as a celebrity. Buckboard

I think there is a lot of validity to this. Some even venture he may have gotten a fifth and did not claim it. I witnessed him being asked the question and he just grinned. HJ 11:07, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

Hey there, HJ. I agree with you completely. I'm going to go through my basement full of sources and see what else I can dig up on the matter (some of my stuff goes back to the 60's), and put together something documentable of at least the possibility.--Buckboard 16:05, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

Definitely not a Vietnam ace. I knew Robin pretty well, and he told me as well as a former Marine Phantom pilot that he avoided a fifth MiG because he knew he would immediately be pulled out of combat. It was far more important to him to remain with his guys in the 8th TFW. If he had downed No. 5 we certainly would've known about it by now--from Robin! --BTillman, 30 Mar 13. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.2.63.115 (talk) 18:01, 30 March 2013 (UTC)

Assuming in good faith you are indeed as inscribed, thanks for the input. The current text reflects and documents from Olds what you say. The only difference from the two sources is the number of fights involved and his motivation: nine or ten, loyalty downward or "nothing worked".? The latter is very Olds-esque in avoiding any explanation that might come off as too self-congratulatory.--Reedmalloy (talk) 04:44, 31 March 2013 (UTC)

Several sources claim that Olds intentionally avoided shooting down a fifth MiG, even during opportunities to do so, because he believed he would be immediately relieved of command as a celebrity. Buckboard’’ Could this be clarified ? Is the meaning that had Olds scored another confirmed kill he would have been (unwillingly) rotated, and thus refused to shoot down the fifth MiG ? It’s not clear--Spjholland (talk) 21:48, 18 November 2015 (UTC)

Yes, that's what it means. Had he shot down a 5th MiG (likely in May or June 67) his command tour would have been cut short by three-to-four months, and he was well aware of this. His own memoir asserts this.--Reedmalloy (talk) 23:50, 18 November 2015 (UTC)

References

Olds' Health Failing

I just learned today, Mar. 8, '07, that Robin Olds is in the intensive care ward of the Steamboat Springs Hospital with stage 4 prostate cancer, and his kidneys are failing fast - not expected to make it out of this one. His life has been the epitiome of fighting against the odds, though. God bless him. ----Raybonz1 16:09, 8 Mar 2007

Olds returned home at the end of March 2007, and as of mid-May is doing much better.--Buckboard 06:15, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

Something I didn't know...

Someone might want to add something about this [1] (or I might do it, but it might be a while till I get around to it) . Apparently he was arrested and plead guilty to drunk driving charges a few years ago. I know, bad timing, what with him in the hospital right now, but nonetheless, something that should go in here. Articles aren't shrines...-- Nobunaga24 14:14, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

It's added. Warts and all.--Buckboard 04:33, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

ribbon bar

Absolutely brilliant. Thanx mucho.--Buckboard 00:35, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

Shouldn't only one Air Medal with the max number of OLC be on the ribbon bar, instead of 3 Air Medals? Or does the Air Force do it different from the army?--Nobunaga24 (talk) 00:21, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

As this photo of Steve Ritchie shows, mutliple AM ribbons are used to avoid cramming a single ribbon with clusters. [2] --Reedmalloy (talk) 04:59, 18 May 2009 (UTC)

GA on hold

• Scion, how about keeping it simple - An heir
• He served out the remainder of his career
• Photostatic copy of Olds' claim report of 14 Feb 45 - random external link
• Link Dogfight in the Dogfight advocate paragraph at the first mention
• This offer was refused and Olds decided to retire from the Air Force.[51]

:Olds retired on June 1, 1973.

Why is there a 3 word paragraph? -> This offer was refused and Olds decided to retire from the Air Force on June 1, 1973.[51]

• periocardial disease - is spelt wrong? Pericardial Disease - article here Pericardial effusion
• Jargon terms - triple ace
• Not required for GA but please add WP:PDATA
• Wikipedia:Manual of Style (numbers), there should be a non-breaking space -   between a number and the unit of measurement. For example, instead of 30 miles, use 30 miles, which when you are editing the page, should look like: 30 miles.^[?]
• Per Wikipedia:Manual of Style (headings), headings generally do not start with articles ('the', 'a(n)')

Looks good, however it seems to glorify him a bit by saying is one of the best and most famous pilots in the lead - who said this? i made a few minor changes myself. Also remember the lead should contain a brief summary of each of the main headings (SE Asia and Personal). M3tal H3ad 03:50, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

"Heir" would be a misnomer--the situation is continuity through generations, not hand me downs. I am not averse to another term, but I object to "heir" as inappropriate. The medical term was used by the source. The description of the disease did not match up to anything I searched thru wiki so I left it as is (something generic re heart disease would serve just as well). The "best and most famous" (I disagree that it is glorification) survived edits from long ago before I ever saw this article--I have no idea who added it or where it came from. The second assessment, documented, is straight out of the source, who is credentialed and knows whereof he speaks. The photostat report shows a gap in wiki--it is there as an illustration as much as a link, but whereever it goes under current guidelines is okay be me. His decision to retire was made many months before he retired, which is how that came about. I'll work on it.-Buckboard 05:56, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

periocardial disease comes up with 43 links in google (nothing to do with a disease) - pericardial disease comes up with 1.11 million, the author must of made a spelling error. Regarding the "best and most famous" you have to give that context by saying who said that -(the air force, high ranking officers, his friends, commanding officer etc) you can't say he is the best and most famous without saying who said that as it would be considered Original Research. He served out the remainder of his career - the 'out' is redundant. You could upload the photostat picture to wiki, add it to the external links section or convert it to a reference. The article is very informative, i like how the Awards and decorations section is done. M3tal H3ad 06:11, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

The medical issue was resolved and documented. See also article Robert Olds.--Reedmalloy (talk) 15:53, 14 May 2009 (UTC)

Gotcha on the "who said it". I reworded the other items and scored through the list above. I moved the report link to externals--it's a two-page photo whose text is very small print and would not make a good picture. I appreciate your comments here, btw.--Buckboard 06:26, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

Goodjob, i hope you plan on taking it further - Biography peer-review, A class MILHIST, FAC etc. Goodluck if you do and thanks for dealing/replying to things i brought up. M3tal H3ad 07:12, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

And he dies right after I sent it to GAC and it became a GA. This means we're gonna have to get it to FA if we can. I don't have access to any of these references, though let me know when it goes to FAC.--Wizardman 02:59, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

FA notes

If this article is to go for Featured status, there are some unsettled fact issues. One of the primary sources stated Daniel Flood (Dem-PA_ nominated Olds, but Flood did not go to Congress until after Olds had graduated and gone to Europe. Second, in its obituary notice, the LA Times stated Olds and Ella Raines were divorced in 1975, not just separated, but I cannot find anything else to confirm this.--Buckboard 05:41, 17 June 2007 (UTC)

Per the Washington Post, the first marriage ended in Ella's death, the second to Morgan Olds in divorce.--Buckboard 07:34, 30 June 2007 (UTC)

The marital history has been cleared up publicly by Olds' daughter Christina, now sourced in article. This was a gap that was never addressed in articles or books, very glad to have it straightened out, and as Christina Olds put it of Morgan Olds, "We'd like to have her correctly acknowledged."--Reedmalloy (talk) 22:24, 5 August 2008 (UTC)

GA Sweeps (Pass)

This excellent article has been reviewed as part of Wikipedia:WikiProject Good articles/Project quality task force. I believe it still meets the criteria and should remain listed as a Good article. The article history has been updated to reflect this review. Great work on this - it was a pleasure to review. Regards, EyeSerene^TALK 18:14, 23 November 2007 (UTC)

Medal Ribbons

Hi could someone confirm - a ribbon is listed as Air Force Cross (UK) but is actually a Distinguished Flying Cross (UK). Which is correct, either the list or the image (or perhaps both) is wrong.

Rob (talk) 12:09, 24 June 2008 (UTC)

The image caption is incorrect--it was the British DFC, not the AFC, per the USAF source listed. However the graphic is an image and beyond my knowhow to change. It has to be changed by the image creater or someone with technical knowledge.--Reedmalloy (talk) 22:32, 5 August 2008 (UTC)

Family addition

Very special thanx for the latest edit.--Reedmalloy (talk) 15:32, 6 May 2009 (UTC)

btw, your father merits an article as well, imho, (and yourself?) but sources are difficult to come by. Any help you can give regarding sources would be very appreciated. If not, thanx for the enlightenment, Navy. Your brother vice half brother was a special person to me.--Reedmalloy (talk) 15:59, 6 May 2009 (UTC)

Went ahead and created the article. Any additions and/or sources would be most welcomed.--Reedmalloy (talk) 15:51, 14 May 2009 (UTC)

Should we add this?

I know this might sound funny but Olds was interviewed on the documentary show - "Dogfights" about an escort mission over the skies of Nazi Germany on his P-38 Lightning, in which he described getting on the six of a Bf-109 and was about to shoot his guns when his engines quit, but he fired anyway and scored a victory despite being in the "glide mode". Question now is, should we add this and is there any reference source to help slot it in? --Dave ^{♠♣♥♦1185♪♫™} 19:09, 11 March 2010 (UTC)

A brief discussion about this event happened at User_talk:Reedmalloy#Kill with no power. Did Olds give this account himself in the film, or did others credit him with it? Binksternet (talk) 19:46, 11 March 2010 (UTC)

• Hi, I managed to catch the "Dogfights (TV series)#Season one/Episode 2: Air Ambush" again and noticed that the description Olds gave matches what he went through during one of his sortie (except that the date was slightly off, given as 24 August 1944 instead of the article's version 11 day after 14 August. don't think that's too big a problem, right?) as described here → Robin Olds#P-38 Lightning missions: "... Montmirail, France, on August 14. Eleven days later he and his wingman became separated from the group on an escort mission to Wismar, and attacked a formation of some 40 Messerschmitt Bf 109s." And it is as he told it, he had punch off his drop tanks shortly before he got behind the six of a Bf-109 and was just about to shoot when the engines quit, he had forgotten to switch back the engine fuel feed from those jettisoned drop tanks! (Pardon the exclamation mark...) --Dave ^{♠♣♥♦1185♪♫™} 03:41, 12 March 2010 (UTC)

Sounds good to me, Dave. I will dig out my sources and start through it. The August date is completely plausible. Also, I saw that episode with Olds on its first go-round, and there was at one time mention of it in the article, but that as my ancestors would say was many moons ago. I'm going to set my DVR to view it again. A quote from the episode would be a good addition. However, first things first and I will review the rather detailed sources I already have. Thanx for the heads up. --Reedmalloy (talk) 16:31, 1 May 2010 (UTC)

Completed (although it will probably be tweaked grammatically from time to time). It was August 25, 1944.--Reedmalloy (talk) 15:00, 7 May 2010 (UTC)

• Thanks, and I'm on it now... "tweaking"! :) --Dave ^{♠♣♥♦1185♪♫™} 15:48, 7 May 2010 (UTC)

Another piece of trivia you may want to add is that the current 1(F) Squadron in the UK named their squadron recreation facility after him. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.158.167.147 (talk) 20:27, 7 July 2017 (UTC)

Yes, the Robin Olds Bar at HQ No.1 Squadron, Lossiemouth, was opened by the US Air Attache in 2016. The USAF Chief of Staff has visited (and presented the squadron with a Stars and Stripes which they fly on 4 July) and they're hoping to get some of Olds' family over. http://www.1fsa.org/sitemanager/uploads/images/1(F)%20Annual%20Update%202016.pdf Khamba Tendal (talk) 14:44, 24 January 2018 (UTC)

Brigadier General Portrait

Found a brigadier general portrait of him here - [3] - I can get it cleaned up at the graphics lab if the principle writers here agree. – Connormah (talk) 03:55, 16 February 2012 (UTC)

Bad idea. The photo appears to at least have a claim of copyright. Since other free images are available, it would be difficult to make a Fair Use argument. Buffs (talk) 05:48, 16 February 2012 (UTC)

It should be PD-USGov-Military-Air Force - the auction house just watermarks it for the sake of stopping it from being used, but we can remove it. But if you think it's a bad idea, then I defer to your judgement. – Connormah (talk) 05:58, 16 February 2012 (UTC)

Certainly the image itself is PD, but the note on it (depending on when it was written) has the capability for copyright. However, if you can digitally remove the writing, it would certainly fall into the Public Domain and be a fine image to add (not as the lead image though...that mustache is just too iconic! :-) Buffs (talk) 15:48, 16 February 2012 (UTC)

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